Episode 609 | Bill Dubuque and Karen Campbell | Writers & EP's | "M.I.A."

[00:00:05] Director's Cut, how are you both doing today? Good, how are you? Well, Derek, how are you? Good. Bill, I'm gonna start with you. I have to say, Bill, I've wanted to ask you this since 2014. You're gonna hear a lot of things about Ozark and the great work you've done, right? And that's rightfully earned. I have to say though, there's movies that should be given more highly regarded than they are. You know, Road to Perdition. I would put the judge in that. And Duval gets Best Supporting Actor. I have a feeling you should have been a big part of that, too.

[00:00:33] And you are a big part of that, that nomination. Thank you. I have to say, when it comes to my own son, I hear these words, and I can't help but think of your work. I looked at him and saw my middle boy. I wanted someone to help him. Like, I'd want to help someone to help my boy if he lost his way. Dude, your work has affected me. I look at my three-year-old boy, and this is a movie I've seen 10 years ago. And I hope, you know, I don't know, if your work impacts others the way it does me, you've got a good ride ahead of you, Bill. You're so very kind.

[00:01:03] I can remember writing those words. And you mentioned Road to Perdition. I used to put on the soundtrack to Road to Perdition while I wrote that. And I would listen to that soundtrack in that particular passage from Duval to Downey. When you put the soundtrack to the Road to Perdition, behind that, I knew I had a hit, because I'd choke myself up every time I read it.

[00:01:30] And when I would tighten that passage down and tighten it and tighten it, I'd listen to it. I'd go back to that script and read it. So I appreciate that very much. Thank you. Yeah, I've always wanted to thank you for that. You've really done a great job. Karen, you're no slouch either. You've done some amazing things in your life. I want to say, though, getting to the show at hand, around the 14-minute mark, I couldn't help but laugh at episode 101, which is a real banger, where she's asking for a beer.

[00:01:59] And he turns to her and says, you know, you're on work time. You know, you can't, you know, maybe when you clock out, and then these drugs come floating up like that. Yeah, it's just such a, like, I had no business enjoying that scene as much as I did. What is your process, the two of you? You guys make a great team. Like, what is the process? Is it meetings? Is it calling? Bill, I'm looking over your shoulder. I see, right? I mean, so Karen, what is your process with Bill?

[00:02:23] You guys are certainly both capable in your own regard, but mixing you guys together creates a heck of a powerhouse for us. I mean, Derek, that is awesome to hear. Thank you so much. That's very generous. I mean, Bill and I, we go all the way back to the summer of 2022. You know, we met the old-fashioned way on a Zoom, and we just got on like a house on fire. We have similar sensibilities.

[00:02:45] We both love character-driven storytelling that has high stakes, that unfolds in a setting that, you know, viewers want to escape into. And, you know, we were having that meeting, and then he mentions that he has this pilot that he thought I'd be a good fit for. It happened to be MIA. That comes my way. I devour it. I read it like in a sitting, and I was immediately in. And then from there, it's just, I mean, Bill's the greatest. So collaborating with him is an absolute joy.

[00:03:15] You know, we start getting on the horn, talking about, you know, Edda's journey, the other character journeys for season one, fleshing out the pitch. And we take it to market, get multiple offers, awesome. And then ultimately, you know, go with Peacock. And then from there, we spend a week together in the room building out scaffolding for that first season. But, I mean, I told Bill this from the jump. Like once I read that pilot, I was like, Bill, male live, like there are five seasons here, you know?

[00:03:43] And yeah, I don't know. I'm a massive, like Bill's just, he's the greatest. So having this opportunity and going on this journey with him has been awesome. Bill, you agree, obviously, right? What's saying again, Derek? You agree with what Karen said, right? Are you caring? Of course I am. I am the greatest. People do love spending time with me. Karen would follow behind me with a notebook writing down everything I said. No, Karen and I make each other laugh.

[00:04:12] I respect Karen quite a bit. The, when you watch the entire season, the success of MIA will be due, I think, primarily because of Karen Campbell. Yeah. Oh, that's very sweet. And I see it. Well, let me tell you about one-on-one. I agree with what you're saying. Can I tell you a secret sauce of one-on-one that I thought, I thought David Denman is maybe the most underrated actor on the planet. And what he did in one-on-one was nothing short of terrific.

[00:04:38] Not that other actors weren't, but like for what he did, for what he added, pretty amazing stuff. Whatever you guys wanted to say to that. I agree 100%, Derek. He just, there is such warmth to him as an actor. And it was just this, it's this wonderful situation where you have the character and then you find the right actor who can imbue the essence of that character. And Denman crushed it.

[00:05:04] He walked right into that and was absolutely meant to be our Dan Jones. Yeah. And that's the surprising part of that scene I love is like, he is this warm, caring guy that, hey, no beer. You're working right now. And then when the drugs come up, you're like, wait, what's going, like, you almost have to reset yourself to get ready for that. You know? So I guess that's really fun. And I have to ask the two of you this because you're such amazing writers. I would imagine, I talk to composers a lot too. A lot of them have to just step away and do something else for a while. What do you guys do when you have to, cause you can't always have your mind on your writing.

[00:05:33] Maybe you can, but I feel like that would be a road to insanity for me. But then again, I have half the brain power that you guys do. What would you, what would you do? What do you guys do to kind of just step away, refresh, reset, recharge, whatever you, each of you wants to say to that. Go ahead, Karen. I mean, Derek, that sounds like such a luxury. You know, it was so full on.

[00:05:58] Like when you're making a television series, you are shot out of a cannon and then that cannon stays in the air until you ultimately get through, like, through the room, through prep, through production, through post and deliver the show. So there was no truly coming up for air. Um, but that's not to say that there aren't moments when you go for a walk or you try to listen to some music or, but, um, but you know, show running is full on.

[00:06:25] And, uh, but I'm going to kick it back over to Bill cause Bill probably has a real good gem for you. I'll tell you, Derek, um, I get up at four. I'm in the office by five. I stay here till seven, seven 30, sometimes eight o'clock work half a day on Saturday. And I go at it. So I got multiple projects going on at once, but which is not to say that I don't look for every opportunity possible to procrastinate and not work. I, I, this office is in a old town, St. Charles, just outside St. Louis.

[00:06:52] I walk up and down these civil war era streets, which all they've kept this historic. And I'm like Don Corleone and, uh, you know, the first Godfather people give me shit for free. Yeah. And, uh, I come back and try to crank out a few more pages. So I'll end with this, you know, a Taylor Sheridan is kind of the same way. And I have to say, I just, I don't know how you do it. Like, I feel like just all that time invested in these great, whether we're talking the accountant, all these wonderful or, or Karen and Dexter.

[00:07:22] I just, you have to come up for air. Maybe have a beer, go for a walk. I don't know. I just, whatever you guys are doing, keep doing it because we're the benefits of your wonderful talents at work. You're very kind. I appreciate it. Thank you. That is very sweet, Derek. Thank you.